Did I do something wrong here?

[guaranteedkill]

I moved to western MA last summer from Minnesota. There are some trails in the woods behind the apartment that my wife and I rent. The trails lead out to a paved bike path that runs along an old railroad corridor. The trails leading to this paved bike path are a few miles long at most and cross over multiple properties along the way, none of which have any "no trespassing" signs posted.

Last weekend, I decided to go out and do some trail maintenance on these trails... nothing crazy... just removing some dead and downed trees from along the trail while also clearing the trail of any overgrowth along the way. While out there, I ran into a neighbor who I had never met. He was an older guy in his 60's. He got pretty upset with me for being out there doing maintenance on the trail. I also ran into a few other people from the neighborhood who were using the trails and they were pretty excited that I was out there doing maintenance. So I just kind of forgot about the older guy.

Well today, I was riding out there. I use these trails as a link to some other riding areas that exist a few miles down the paved bike trail. When I was riding, I had a small crash. As I was resting, the old guy from last week came hiking down the trail. When he saw me with my bike, he got very angry and started yelling at me. He actually told me that he forbid bikes on this trail, even though it was not his property. The trail does actually go through part of his property but the part of the trail that he encountered me on was not his property. And when you actually do get to his property, he has no signs posted about trespassing. Actually, none of the properties that this trail goes through have any signs posted. But he was threatening me with lawyers and stuff and told me that the next time he catches me out there, he will do something about it. Keep in mind, this whole confrontation happened on the portion of the trail behind my apartment building... not his land.

So I have a couple questions here. First, did I do anything wrong? Obviously, I know that you can't just walk onto someone's property (posted or not) and start cutting down trees and building trails. But I was just doing some basic trail maintenance.

Second, are mountain bikes allowed to ride trails that exist on property that is not posted for trespassing, especially when other trail users use those trails (hikers, runners, skiers, snowmobiles)?

Third, should I continue to ride these trails and just avoid the portion that goes through his property or should I just not ride any of the trails anymore?

Thanks for reading and thanks for any insight.

[thomllama]

need to find out who actually owns the property(s) one guy doesn't rule the world... there are anti bike people in the world,.. don't get it but hey... who knows what they think.

you shouldn't do any "trail maintenance" unless you got the OK from the land owner/manager.. if you're just picking up stick it's not an issue, but if you have to whip out a saw or something you need approval first.

[hammerhead]

Yeah, you're probably in the wrong. Just because the trails are established doesn't mean that the land-owners are aware, or if they are, on-board with them being used by all possible users. It is amazing the number of people that are surprised that anyone would ride a bike on a trail, and therefore wouldn't even consider posting them closed to bikes. That said, there are many trails that pass on private land without explicit permission for every potential user group being sought or granted. Many started life as MX, livestock, wildlife, mini-bike or other informal trails.

Once you know the landowner isn't on board, you'd be a fool to keep using his property until/unless you or someone else negotiates conditions for resumed access by cyclists.

[guaranteedkill]

Thanks for the info guys. I am just gonna avoid these trails from now on. I just don't want to deal with this guy anymore. It is still amazing to me that someone would get so upset over someone else trying to do something as nice and simple as a little trail cleanup... what a real nice welcome to the neighborhood.

Anyway, thanks again. One more question...

There are a few conservation areas in my town that have a ton of trails through them. There are no signs or any information anywhere indicating that no mountain biking is allowed. I ride through there quite a bit and often come across other trail users who never seem to mind my presence. I also see other mountain bikers out there too and have also noticed that some new trails had been built recently (which mountain bikers have been using). And from what I hear from other riders, these new trails were built by a fellow mountain biker who lives in the area.

So does that mean that mountain biking there is legal?

Sorry about all the questions. This stuff is pretty confusing and I do not see any info on the NEMBA website explaining these sorts of things.

Thanks again.

[hammerhead]

Don't be afraid to ask. Conservation areas are overseen by conservation commissions usually, though other town committees may share in the stewardship. Start by attending a meeting and asking what the policies are...

[guaranteedkill]

Awesome. Thanks for the information. I will definitely check that out.

Don't be afraid to ask. Conservation areas are overseen by conservation commissions usually, though other town committees may share in the stewardship. Start by attending a meeting and asking what the policies are...

[pulsepro]

Thanks for the info guys. I am just gonna avoid these trails from now on. I just don't want to deal with this guy anymore. It is still amazing to me that someone would get so upset over someone else trying to do something as nice and simple as a little trail cleanup... what a real nice welcome to the neighborhood.

Anyway, thanks again. One more question...

There are a few conservation areas in my town that have a ton of trails through them. There are no signs or any information anywhere indicating that no mountain biking is allowed. I ride through there quite a bit and often come across other trail users who never seem to mind my presence. I also see other mountain bikers out there too and have also noticed that some new trails had been built recently (which mountain bikers have been using). And from what I hear from other riders, these new trails were built by a fellow mountain biker who lives in the area.

So does that mean that mountain biking there is legal?

Sorry about all the questions. This stuff is pretty confusing and I do not see any info on the NEMBA website explaining these sorts of things.

Thanks again.

Check your PMs.

[Slappy]

I would definitely find out who actually owns the properties and where they stand on biking.

We've got some extremely arrogant so-called 'environmentalists' in my area. They are so full of themselves, they believe they have the right to make the rules on other people's property and don't hesitiate to claim it as their own. They have no problem at all telling you they make the rules on property they have no claim to whatsoever, because they've deluded themselves into thinking they own the woods in it's entirety. Sounds like you've met a guy just like that.

Get your facts in a row first - go to town hall and get a plan showing property lines and owners. If he actually does own any of the land (which I wouldn't necessarily believe just on his word), is there a way you can re-route the trail so it doesn't cross his property? We've had lots of luck with private property owners allowing us to pass through. If he doesn't own any of the land and the people that do are cool with biking, have fun setting him straight. Then get ready for the booby-traps and vandalism, cuz that's how those people operate. I'm installing game cameras this week to catch them in the act. Should be a nice surprise when they find out they got caught on film.

[guaranteedkill]

I would definitely find out who actually owns the properties and where they stand on biking.

We've got some extremely arrogant so-called 'environmentalists' in my area. They are so full of themselves, they believe they have the right to make the rules on other people's property and don't hesitiate to claim it as their own. They have no problem at all telling you they make the rules on property they have no claim to whatsoever, because they've deluded themselves into thinking they own the woods in it's entirety. Sounds like you've met a guy just like that.

Get your facts in a row first - go to town hall and get a plan showing property lines and owners. If he actually does own any of the land (which I wouldn't necessarily believe just on his word), is there a way you can re-route the trail so it doesn't cross his property? We've had lots of luck with private property owners allowing us to pass through. If he doesn't own any of the land and the people that do are cool with biking, have fun setting him straight. Then get ready for the booby-traps and vandalism, cuz that's how those people operate. I'm installing game cameras this week to catch them in the act. Should be a nice surprise when they find out they got caught on film.

This is a great response. Thanks Slappy.

So I have done some of the research. I was able to find the property line zoning maps for my town online. I checked out the property lines that this trail goes through and sure enough, this guy was totally lying to me. His property comes no where close to the trails.

Also, I talked to my landlords about this situation. They informed me that he has been doing this for years... harassing other trail users in the woods behind our building. They also told me that their children used to ride their 4 wheelers on those very same trails and he never complained. So I do not understand why he has such a problem with me being out there. But my landlord told me he was going to call this guy and tell him to back off. I guess they know each other pretty well.

[hammerhead]

knowledge is power...