FS Tandems

[GandALF2]

Hey folks.

I'm just looking for info at this point. I'd like to get a full suspension tandem for my wife and I. I've seen a couple of brands in various locations over the years but have no experience with them myself. I know that Ventana makes a pretty good one but wanted to get some input from somebody who has actually ridden one of these "monsters".

My wife does not ride in the woods or anywhere else for that matter. I thought that this might be a good way for her to experience the woods the way I do and not be threatened by the "piloting" part. Thoughts? Chime in ladies if you think I'm going down the wrong path with her. (pun intended).

[Jisch]

I remember reading something about how the best way to "test" the strength of your marriage is to ride a tandem (kind of like building a house).

There used to be a tandem section of the forums, it looked like fun, but I think I'm better off on my own two wheels.

John

[bike187]

i believe nicolai makes a fs tandem as well.

as far as breaking your wife into mtb via tandeming, makes sure you do alot of road riding first. i've ridden a tandem a few times with my cousin and i was in the back (stoker i believe?) and taking turns at first was very odd. i had to lean in unison with the pilot. doing this on new england singletrack where you sometimes have to weave through stuff, would not be that easy, or so i'd imagine. i'm assuming you're starting off on like dirt road type stuff though, but going over rocks may still present an issue.

wait a few days, as i remember, there are a few people on the forum that ride mtb tandems.

goodluck

[C.P.]

I'm Pretty sure the tandem gurus on the forum include:
Couch, Pk, TGrimble, and Splat. There are others, but I remember seeing lots of pics and posts from them when the tandem section was here.

[AA]

Yeti makes some good points. Off road tandeming is a tough way to introduce your wife to mt biking. See if you can rent or borrow a tandem first and go for some easy rides (road or easy fire road) FS tandems are big $$ so you want to make sure you like it before you make the plunge. As mentioned previously she wont see much from the "stoker" position except when you go down steep grades then she may see something she dosent like ;D, my wife has learned to shut her eyes when the going gets tough. Remember the biggest challenge on the tandem is getting over logs and rocks because you cant hop the tandem like a single bike. Going super slow is also tricky because of the long wheelbase and 2 riders sometimes moving in different directions, momentum is your friend.

The tandem can be a marriage maker or a marriage breaker, good luck

[hammerhead]

Alf,

I wouldn't want to try it on some of your trails up there!

I'm thinking you'd be much better off getting the wife into biking on her own wheels...

H.

[AA]

you can always try out a beauty like this....

[splat]

As One who has a tandem,

simple advice

Get them good and comfortable just riding on the road on a tandem before you venture off road.

You have to build up a serious trust factor with your Stoker. and that is 10X off road.

My wife and I have been riding a Tandem for Years ( although the last few her spot was replaced with my Son ) and She Will not go off road on the tandem.

[T Grimble]

I agree with AA. Borrow or rent a tandem first to see if you like it. The first time my wife and I rode a tandem we borrowed AA's and rode with PK, Stig and their respective stokers. We did a very mellow ride on gravel roads.

You may find that a hardtail is all you need. I did a test ride on the Ellsworth Witness severl years ago. We were riding out west and it was comfortable but that particular bike had extra lenth in the stoker cockpit and that made it a little twisty. I would be suspect of it on tight New England Singletrack but that is just my opinion. You need to get the stokers perspective.

-Tom

[CouchingTiger]

A bunch of us spent a few years offroad tandeming. We rode some stuff that really pushed the limits. We found that lots of these trails (StoneRow at GB, Lynn Woods, the steeps at KT) pushed well past the limits of the equipment. In the years we had the MTB tandem we broke drive chains, timing chains, freehubs (many, many freehubs), a hub shell, cassettes (sheared cogs off the carrier body), a crank arm and lots of tires.

The problem for us was simply the torque we could generate and the fact that we typically were able to ride further into techical stuff (mainly climbs) than most of the crew. That meant we stressed the parts more.

Unfortunately, it is my opinion that they do not make tandem drivetrain gear that is sufficient to take the rigors of real offroad use (mainly the torque applied in climbing). That said, if you can ride well, there are very few trails and obstacles that can't be conquered on a tandem. The biggest problems are steep ups that you can't get a run on and getting over obstacles like logs and rocks because, as AA pointed out, you can't wheelie and hop. The center tube also hits everything as does the timing chain.

The issue with suspension and tandems is simply that most suspension isn't really designed for a tandem weight application, which means getting enough preload or the springs heavy enough to actually have some travel left after the sag is tough. The only fork I could find was a tandem specific C-dale (which they don't make anymore). Stratos used to make one but their stuff is pretty crappy (I had one of the forks and busted it on my single bike).

A couple years ago after many good times but also some memorable bad times, we converted our MTB tandem to a road rig. Last year we sold it and bought a road rig. No regrets. If we want to go offroad (like on dirt roads) we can put cross or 29" tires on and have at it.

-Couch

[T Grimble]

I believe Couch's issues to be unique.
There are few tandem teams that can produce the amount of torque that they can. They are also both very advanced riders and were pushing the limit way beyond normal. Even though they claim to be retired, they hold many of the un-offical records such as:

First tandem team to take flight.
Highest tandem drop.
Fastest road descent.
They are also capable of throwing the tandem the farthest in frustration but I gave them some stiff competition on this one.

[jh_on_the_cape]

my wife rides a bit, not that much. she has ridden kingdom trails, etc, but doesnt like getting to the edge of control.

we borrowed a road tandem for a while. it was terrible. not fun at all.

your wife should be first very comfortable riding on the road. next very comfortable riding offroad. then comfortable riding tandem on road, and finally tandem offroad.

just get her to go for a bike ride, maybe with a little dirt road involved. if you are too fast so it's boring ( or she is too slow), try riding a fixed gear. This slowed me down on the road, particularly on downhills. and it's fun!

has anyone done offroad tandem fixed gear??? ahh!!!

[GandALF2]

Anything from the ladies out there?


No Harold, I'm not taking her up/down any of our "speshull" trails out here in the hills of Petersham. I'm thinking gravel roads.......but there is this one really cool hucking....oops that's my evil side coming out.

[jaime]

we borrowed a road tandem for a while. it was terrible. not fun at all.

your wife should be first very comfortable riding on the road. next very comfortable riding offroad. then comfortable riding tandem on road, and finally tandem offroad.

just get her to go for a bike ride, maybe with a little dirt road involved. if you are too fast so it's boring ( or she is too slow), try riding a fixed gear. This slowed me down on the road, particularly on downhills. and it's fun!

has anyone done offroad tandem fixed gear??? ahh!!!


I'd recommend road tandeming as a way to get your wife more involved in riding. My wife & I have recently gotten involved in road tandeming (thanks Stig!), and my wife hasn't ridden much in the past. Riding single bikes together is kind of a non-starter for us: she doesn't like to feel like the weak link, so she'll push herself to a pace that leads to explosion after 45 mins. Slight competitive streak there ;^) We found road tandeming to be a great equalizer, since we can each work as hard as we like, & rest when necessary. We initially borrowed a steel framed hybrid tandem nad just couldn't get comfy on it. I didn't realize it at the time but it wass too flexy and we never got over that squirrely feeling. We then got to try a much stiffer aluminum framed bike and it made all the difference. Maybe your experience was similar, jh, in that it was the bike rather than the format that was weird?

Anyway, it's a great equalizer for spouses of very different ability levels. The Couches are a whole other story....

[jh_on_the_cape]

we borrowed a road tandem for a while. it was terrible. not fun at all.

your wife should be first very comfortable riding on the road. next very comfortable riding offroad. then comfortable riding tandem on road, and finally tandem offroad.

just get her to go for a bike ride, maybe with a little dirt road involved. if you are too fast so it's boring ( or she is too slow), try riding a fixed gear. This slowed me down on the road, particularly on downhills. and it's fun!

has anyone done offroad tandem fixed gear??? ahh!!!


I'd recommend road tandeming as a way to get your wife more involved in riding. My wife & I have recently gotten involved in road tandeming (thanks Stig!), and my wife hasn't ridden much in the past. Riding single bikes together is kind of a non-starter for us: she doesn't like to feel like the weak link, so she'll push herself to a pace that leads to explosion after 45 mins. Slight competitive streak there ;^) We found road tandeming to be a great equalizer, since we can each work as hard as we like, & rest when necessary. We initially borrowed a steel framed hybrid tandem nad just couldn't get comfy on it. I didn't realize it at the time but it wass too flexy and we never got over that squirrely feeling. We then got to try a much stiffer aluminum framed bike and it made all the difference. Maybe your experience was similar, jh, in that it was the bike rather than the format that was weird?

Anyway, it's a great equalizer for spouses of very different ability levels. The Couches are a whole other story....


we were on a cannondale, pretty nice one. i think it's stiff.

my wife would freak that we were going to fast downhills and around corners. then there was the whole starting and stopping thing. and she got tired of looking at my back.

if tandems were not so expensive, i might just get one for the occasional ride. but a good tandem is bucks.

the one we borrowed is from a couple where one of them is visually impaired and can only ride stoker.

[cgrimble]

I'm a stoker for TGrimble. Not that we've been out much in the past couple of years due to our 18 month old but I really like the tandem. I can't ride with Tom on a single bike because we just don't ride the same pace -its nice to be able to keep up with him and the only way I can do that is on the tandem.

However, to be honest, I'm not sure I would enjoy off-road tandeming if I wasn't used to riding off road by myself - it can be a bit hairy on the back when you have no control over the line or the speed or the terrain. If your wife isn't already a biker, she might find the off mountain tandem tricky as you've got to have pretty good bike balance otherwise you can really mess things up - or so I've been told by the captain!!!

We are lucky enough to have both a road tandem and a mountain tandem and I prefer the road tandem.

Claire

[MrsCouch]

They are also capable of throwing the tandem the farthest in frustration but I gave them some stiff competition on this one.


Tom - that made me laugh out loud, but you left out the threats of divorce ;).

Let me also chime in as a stoker. An offroad tandem is NOT the way to get your wife out on the trails if she doesn't ride them on her own. This type of riding takes complete trust in the captain, and can DEFINITELY be a deal breaker.

I remember the year that Couch and I raced at Freetown on our tandem - that place was really tricky, and there was swearing and tears involved. It was tough because Couch was racing above his max to make up for me, and I was racing above my max to keep up with him. The happy ending was that we won the race, and I married him anyway ;).

Oh - let me also say that crashing a tandem in the woods is just plain nasty...

I MUCH prefer the road tandem these days, and we have had lots of epic adventures. It's a great way for us to stay together.


Fastest road descent.


C'mon - 58 mph isn't THAT fast ;D

Overall, I'd echo what others have said - try before you buy! And the road is likely a better bet if your stoker doesn't already ride in the woods.

MrsCouch

[GandALF2]

Wow,

Thanks everybody,especially the ladies. A guys perspective on such things tends to be tainted by testosterone and beer goggles. I just didn't want to repeat my efforts of two years ago where I bought her a new bike only to have it sit in the cellar. BTW, is anyone interested in a two year old, albeit dusty, Specialized Stumpjumper....just kidding!

I may end up facing the fact that her recreational interests will never include careening down stupidly steep hills with rocks, roots and logs and then riding up the same. Hmmm - that does sound stupid...again, just kidding. ;D

Alf

"Use the force Luke, let go" (my riding style)
Obi Wan Kenobi

[Chris_T]

We rented a road tandem on MV last summer and concluded that two control freaks like us were better off on our own.

Try before you buy!

-C

[Jisch]

Reminds me of a cross country motorcycle trip I took with my then girlfriend now wife during the college years. She has a motorcycle license, but we're on my bike a Suzuki 850 with a full fairing (heavy bike). We're in VA in the Blue Ridge Mountains on some really nice twisty, high speed roads. I convince the wife to drive for a little while since it was so much fun. After about 5 miles of me leaning early we decided that she made a much better passenger than I did.

I've never seen someone work so hard to keep a bike upright. I'm leaning in, she's leaning out. ugh.

John

[T Grimble]

I remember the year that Couch and I raced at Freetown on our tandem - that place was really tricky, and there was swearing and tears involved.

You never told my you made Couch cry.

[splat]

C'mon - 58 mph isn't THAT fast ;D

Overall, I'd echo what others have said - try before you buy! And the road is likely a better bet if your stoker doesn't already ride in the woods.

MrsCouch


No Offense , but on a tandem on a steep road decent 58 isn't that fast!!!

and if anyone has ever ridden with Jon and Pam from the CRW you would know what i mean! ( rt 100 in VT )

[MrsCouch]

No Offense , but on a tandem on a steep road decent 58 isn't that fast!!!

and if anyone has ever ridden with Jon and Pam from the CRW you would know what i mean! ( rt 100 in VT )


Until you're the one on the back with no control holding on for dear life ;D. I love speed on the tandem, actually (at least better than riding Stone Row on one). That was our speed descending from Wachussett. Ask PK about that experience.....

MrsCouch

[GandALF2]

Another interesting aspect of tandems is the exact location of where the stokers hadlebars are attached. A friend of mine and his dad were at a race several years ago with all the usual vendors in attendance. Cannondale had one of their early FS tandems available for demo rides. Well, these two, both being strong riders thought that they would give it a try, after all how hard can it be. It's still a bicycle. The son was the skipper and the dad just had to sit back and enjoy the BO coming off of his son. They made it to the first hard corner when dad decides he wants to steer the bike as well. Bad idea! The stokers "handlebars" were attached to the seatpost of the skipper! You can imagine the surprise of the son when his seat started rotating just as he was trying to steer the ship! These were two big strong guys. I gathered from their report that a lenghty and heated discussion ensued.

Question: Can one divorce himself from his offspring? Just kidding everyone!