New bike - rethinking

[Slider]

So I have my Dean, and love it. I have my Giant NRS1, and it is OK, but doesn't really fit well. I was thinking I wanted to go long travel, 4-5", but now I am reconsidering.

Handling is key for me, and I really like a tight, fast single track with lots of right/left fast turns. Maybe all that travel would be bad there. Maybe I really want something stiffer than the Dean for the fast single track, but capable of wearing some big rubber for the moderate hucks along the way. I am now leaning toward aluminum, since the tires whould take away the harshness.

I would like to keep it reasonably light, but up to supporting my 230lbs, and ready for 2.4" rubber and a long travel fork. So what frames fit the bill?

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[gnurider1080]

a sinister splinter er possibly? i know that some people have had trouble with the push/pull rod on the splinter mx but providing the linkage is the same, the er should be a very capable trail bike. it is a bit pricey however.

[Bikenow]

Slider,

I have a Santa Cruz Heckler that is a great all around bike. The Specialized Enduro is a nice bike and is outfitted with a fox 36 and Avid hydos' at a reasonable price. Happy hunting.

Bill

[MMcG]

If you want to stick with a hardtail that can handle a 5" fork, look at the On-One Inbred 456 frame.

It'll be nimble, responsive feel of steel, designed around a longer travel fork, strong yet not porky and you'll be able to run wide tires too.

That is if you want a hardtail - sounds like you are leaning more towards the FS spectrum.

Of note, soon On-One will be offering a 29er frame and also I think a frame with those sliding dropouts that can be used as single speed or geared. Cool stuff.

And their prices are very reasonable as they have a US distributor. You can order direct from them but the item gets sent from the US distributor.

[MTBME]

First of all I hope your not considering a hardtail. After riding FS for a while, if I go back to the aluminum hardtail, I can't believe the beating I'm taking and how the rear tire is all over the place in the ruff stuff.

If you like fast swoopy singletrack, I think the big suspension rigs might take away some of that tight control your looking for. I might consider a Specialized Epic where the rear suspension is held a bit in check. I have a FS Stumpjumper with a Fox Float 80 up front that's light, fast, and climbs well. It rides like an efficent hardtail that takes the edge off the ruff stuff.

[Slider]

I should have been more clear. Hardtail is the way I think I want to go. Big rubber, long travel in the front, and strong, but not TOO overbuilt. I won't be dirt-ramping it, but night hit a 3-4' huck once in a while.

Most of the time, I'll be hitting fast single track, along with the usual New England roots and rocks. So riding position is important. I am 6'1", and like a comfortably large frame.

I think that's enough parameters. Clear enough?

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[Quo Fan]

I'd look into the all mountain bikes with stable platform suspension. You can tune the suspension anyway you like. I have a Cake with stable platform, and I run it a little soft, though I could tighten it up if I wanted to.

[gnurider1080]

if you are looking for a hardtail might i suggest a sinister ridge? if mine was built up with some lighter parts it would be a killer trail bike. although i have done a couple xc rides with it and the bike is awesome. combined with a 36 talas up front that bike would be awesome for trail riding and hitting the occasional drop.

[C.P.]

-Hardtail is the way I think I want to go.
-something stiffer than the Dean for the fast single track
-capable of wearing some big rubber
-leaning toward aluminum
-reasonably light
-ready for 2.4" rubber and a long travel fork

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Here's my E-Opinion (biased I own one built as a SS with a 130mm fork:
Santa Cruz Chameleon (http://www.santacruzbicycles.com/bicycles/chameleon.php)

A plus here is it meets all your criteria nicely, and if it doesn't work out - it has horiz drops to build up a nice SS!

[Slider]

The Sinister looks cool. I compared the measurement to the Dean Colonel, and their Large is as big or bigger than the Dean XL in the key dimensions, with top tube length being the most critical, I think.

It is steeper at the head angle, but I guess that makes up for the long travel fork. Tire clearance says 2.7 on a 1" rim, which should be about enough.

I'll have to chack on a demo ride. No dealers near me, so I'll have to travel, but that is no biggie

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[Slider]

The Santa Cruz runs a little smaller than the Sinister, but it is hard to tell how a bike feels from a spec chart. Definitely worth a ride.

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[Slider]

That On-One Inbred doesn't seem to be built for a long travel fork. Steel might be tempting, though.

Slider

[imploded]

Slider,

I'm 255# and 6'2" and ride a Specialized Epic. This bike is incredibly fast, especially in the corners. It drops on the lines without even thinking and when you get on the gas it does nothing but go. Getting the brain and rear shock set up takes some time, I would say it wasn't until I had at least 150 miles on the bike that I got the rear end sorted out. The Epic can behave like a hardtail on some root gardens (I find the first root into the garden is rougher than on something like an Enduro), but if you gas it, it just goes. Some people think the Epic is twitchy, I disagree, it is "sensitive" but it's like any racer: it wants to go FAST. However, low speed handling takes some getting used to (I'm using more and more body english to get the bike to do what I want in low speed situations, ask BadDNA)

If I'm down in CT (Simsbury) any time soon, you're welcome to take my Epic for a spin. Or if you are up in Uxbridge... same offer applies.

The downsides are that you are looking at a FS bike and I don't think you could get more than a 2.2-2.3 on there. Tolerances are pretty tight in the rear on my 2.00s.

Cheers,

-Andrew

[Mt.A TODD]

The 06' Kona Hoss deluxe looks like nice burly trail bike that won't break the bank.

[bdee]

Uh yeah, what CP said. Chameleon with a long travel fork and you'll be all set. The bikes rail corners and if you like hucking at all you'll love the geometry on the SC. I have no issues climbing on mine, even with a Z1 (it does have ETA in case I need it). Mine is heavy at 30lbs but you could go with a lighter build and be in the 27lb range without compromising durability. The newer ones have pretty laid back geo. but handle well as XC/trailbikes. One thing I've noticed is it doesn't ride as harsh as some other aluminum XC bikes I've ridden (2 Jamis Komodos, 1 Specialized S Works, 2 Homegrowns) and it'll fit a fat tire no problem. It's so manueverable that you can ride it through rough stuff easier, maybe that's part of why it doesn't feel so harsh. Oh yeah did I mention that a short wheelbase = easy wheelies, even for the wheelie impaired among us. I wouldn't take mine to say TOT or Big River, but I would ride it anywhere there's a lot of rocks, small drops and generally technical riding - which about sums up everywhere else most of us ride.

[adam30k]

Someone's already mentioned the Hoss and Hoss Deluxe, they are both clydesdale bikes but they are hardtails. For everything that you are talking about, a hardtail really sounds like a good idea if you want fast response on fast singletrack. It will take some getting used to picking lines more carefully but the weight reduction will be a plus.

[MMcG]

That On-One Inbred doesn't seem to be built for a long travel fork. Steel might be tempting, though.

Slider


The One One Inbred 456 was designed "around" a long travel fork. Look again, I think it is what you might be looking for. Long top tubes, great geometry to run the long travel fork and not be all choppered out etc. etc.

Also, it is a steel frame vs. an AL (Chameleon) so it'll be a little more forgiving out there on the rocks and roots of Connecticut for you.

http://www.yungama.co.uk/456_2.jpg

There are a few different companies making bikes like this in steel. On One, Dialled bikes, and Cotic Cycles are three UK based companies building long travel hardtails. I think On One even may have plans for a Ti based version of their 456 Inbred hardtail. The On One prices aren't too bad in the US either. $400 plus shipping for a 456. I've checked into em heavily.

Here's a Dialled Prince Albert:

http://www.dialledbikes.com/a1.jpg

And a Cotic Soul

http://mark.scottishclimbs.com/gallery/photos/coticInHouse.jpg


What about a Surly Instigator?

http://www.trailblasters.co.uk/images/bikes_tom_surly.jpg

I ended up going the "used" budget route and picked up a Surly Instigator. It just needs disc brakes and she'll be trail worthy.

Or check out the hardtails this dude is building, http://www.ramblumtick.com

http://www.ramblumtick.com/img/jpg/gallery/full/bike16.jpg

You could easily go custom and get a killer bike too, say from Waltworks, or this Ramblumtick guy, or maybe even Ted Wojcik could build you up something sweet if you wanted to keep it New England based.

Also, try to find info on the bikes that Steve Stickel (D.F.L) on mtbr.com is building. His frames kick major butt and he knows what works well for east coast riding.

Good luck in your search and keep us posted!

[ArmOnFire]

Try 29 inch wheels, Fisher will have 7 models in their 2006 lineup.
See mtbr forums/29 inch bikes

I demo'd this(GF X-cal) at Pedro's am am sold on it.
It just makes sense for taller/bigger people.

[Slider]

All awesome and appreciated suggestions. I have some homework to do. Will post milestones along the way, and, someday, pix!

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[Slider]

A couple of CA boys we rode with at Case yesterday were talking up the Cove Stiffee. It seems to have the right geometry and should be beefy enough for me. Has seen, ridden or owned one of these? Any input would be appreciated.

The Case ride brought home the point that my Dean is not up to nasty technical stuff under my weight. The frame can handle it, but I trashed the near-new rear wheel. The Dean won't take a 1" rim with a 2.24 or larger tire. It has no trouble making time on those big fullies even on the downhills, but both me and the bike are getting real beat doing it. I want a fat tire and beefy rim!

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[MMcG]

A couple of CA boys we rode with at Case yesterday were talking up the Cove Stiffee. It seems to have the right geometry and should be beefy enough for me. Has seen, ridden or owned one of these? Any input would be appreciated.

The Case ride brought home the point that my Dean is not up to nasty technical stuff under my weight. The frame can handle it, but I trashed the near-new rear wheel. The Dean won't take a 1" rim with a 2.24 or larger tire. It has no trouble making time on those big fullies even on the downhills, but both me and the bike are getting real beat doing it. I want a fat tire and beefy rim!

Slider


IF_Rider owns and rides a Stiffee - hit him up for his thoughts.

[Ben-O]

Try 29 inch wheels, Fisher will have 7 models in their 2006 lineup.
See mtbr forums/29 inch bikes


I second ArmOnFire's suggestion. I just recently test rode a 29 inch wheeled Fisher bike; it has a really interesting feel to it, and would consider one if I were buying a hardtail.

Usually, the differences between bikes is fairly subtle (although bikers appreciate those subtle differences), and it was nice to test ride a bike that clearly felt different--whether you like it or not.

[If_Rider]

I really like my stiffee...that didn't come out right. Anyway, it's a beefy rig and it handles well. I don't really have anything to compare it to besides my IF which is steel. Couch owned one and a chameleon (plus a bunch of others) so he may have some better insight.

[S2RT]

Take a look at the Foes FXR. The more time I spend on mine, the more versatile I find it. It's not too light that it can't take a pounding, but light enough for the X/C, twisty stuff. Very stable on steep/rocky descents, and climbs well too. At 5-6" travel, it's well suited to New England terrain.
There is a LBS in Exeter, that carries them.

[rigidhack]

How about a Banshee Scirocco? Nowhere nearly as beefcake as their Morphine frame, but tough as. Plus you can find the frames for reasonably cheap. Killer warranty, too. You can run it with a 7" DC fork (but why would you?)

That or a Sinister Ridge - beautiful bikes those.

[jh_on_the_cape]

hey. take a look at the evil sovereign. There is a guy at Northeastern selling a used one. I am super curious about this bike, so it's on my mind.

very burly (6.1 pound steel frame). long travel fork. and adjustable chainstay length, so you can go SS, but also mess with geometry.

a new england company, too.

you can also go with a 24" wheel in the back, which will be VERY strong.

http://www.evilbikes.com/images/structures/sov_banner.jpg

[MMcG]

hey. take a look at the evil sovereign. There is a guy at Northeastern selling a used one. I am super curious about this bike, so it's on my mind.

very burly (6.1 pound steel frame). long travel fork. and adjustable chainstay length, so you can go SS, but also mess with geometry.

a new england company, too.

you can also go with a 24" wheel in the back, which will be VERY strong.

http://www.evilbikes.com/images/structures/sov_banner.jpg

Not a bad call at all on the Sovereign. I'm still surprised it weighs as much as it does = to a Surly Instigator that is 4130 cromo - well that's what my 16" Instigator runs.

I was also a little surprised that a Sinister Ridge is in the 5.5 pound range as well. for that extra half pound - I'd take the steel frame (Soverign, Instigator)over the AL version, but that's just me.

I think some of the ones I mentioned (the On One and the Dialled etc.) come in a little bit under 5 pounds believe it or not. I guess it all depends on how much "hucking" you might be planning on doing with said frame.

This is a cool thread.